MightyMax 18Ah AGM battery

[sternwake]

4 hours ago battery read 13.34v
Just now it reads 13.28v.

[sternwake]

Nearly 28 hours after it was removed from the charger, it reads 13.25v.

[TWIH]

Appreciate the detailed charging test results.

I bought another “on sale” HF Centek 3/1 jump pack yesterday primarily for the battery and parts. $39.96, I didnt have a 20% coupon (darn) to save another $8 but it was a good 3 day sale.  I now have 2 of them so the Edge will have some backup for starting (5 yr old battery) and small electronics recharging.

Since I don’t have all of SW’s fancy test equipment I just leave them on 24-30 hrs plugged in no matter if there’s that “soothing green light” or what. Doing that monthly so it should defeat any FLA static loss.

Nice to see that the on sale prices, especially if you had a coupon, are below the cost of just the 17-18 AH battery itself.

[sternwake]

This battery seems to settle into the 13.20v range for full charge rested voltage in 2 to 3 days. I've only done a few minor skim the top and quick recharges to it since, and the amps refuse to taper to under 0.13@14.7v before they start rising again.

I tried to pry some more info out of Mightymax battery regarding what charge parameters and sort of mocked them and their marketing. They have not followed up other than to asked my name and where it was shipped.

In good light I saw that my battery has a may 2018 date code, so it sat for 7 months self discharging.. The 12.87v it arrived at, is certainly a lot lower than the 13.25v it rests fully charged at.

How long these batteries sit and self discharge and how much capacity they actually lose in that time, never to be recovered, is of course an unknown along with the many other unknowns.

I certainly have recycled all the parts from many jumper packs, and will be using a set of the clamps and cables as a portable set up on this battery, at some point. These currently have 45 amp anderson powerpoles on them which I do not really want to be briefly passing 140+ amps for starter motor current, as at some point I will see if this battery by itself can crank and my v8 engine. I'm still debating how I want to rig this battery up to make it quick to remove and jump another vehicle or act as a portable 12vDC source

No doubt recharging these monthly if unused is very wise. My intial recharge after the deep cycle showed that at 13.6v amps tapered to zero indicating no more charging was occurring, but then a boost back upto 14.7 revealed it was not quite full. The premature float of most automatic chargers will still cause premature degradation of capacity, but whether this is worthy of getting upset over is of course subjective. The ideal AGM recharge parameter for this battery is an unknown, but AGMs can be tickled to death with too low of charge current.

With AGMS bringing the volts to 14.7ish and seeing how many amps it takes is very informative as to state of charge. i really expected amps to taper to lower than they do on this battery, and perhaps that behavior will change as it ages.

checking flooded batteries with a hydrometer is nice for another data point, but messy, verification of state of charge, so since i have the wattmeter going anyway on any battery I recharge, the elimination of the hydrometer is a bonus.

Not knowing hom many amps the battery is accepting at whatever voltage the charging source has decided upon, is kind of like driving somewhere, without a map, but also not knowing the starting point, the destination, or how fast one is going to drive.

[TWIH]

That’s a true last paragraph except that most folk don’t have any idea what their vehicles’ starting battery is like as far as condition, yet they seem to last for years as long as not allowed to go dead. 

My Edge has the Ford battery management system (BMS), which since 2011 is in most Ford products. It further reduces alternator charging (so as to save another .1 of a gallon of fuel, my cynical determination). See this “Alternator not charging” post which includes a link to a very interesting YT video of the Ford Technician showing how this BMS actually works and why the old standby of using a multimeter to test what the instantaneous voltage coming from the alternator is no longer the correct way of doing it (on these Fords anyway). It was crazy to see the system allowing the battery to fall to 12.2 for awhile and then only calling for increased voltage as the load ramped up...

Post and link: “Just wanted to pass this info along as some may be experiencing perceived weak batteries or just want to do the occasional checkup before a long road trip and bam you find the alternator is not charging, don't worry just yet here is why....”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAJeDX-T-Eg

Thus the starter battery isn’t even receiving the lower voltage float-type charge while driving unless the computer determines that the battery needs it. Yet somehow over the last 5 years this starter battery (a mighty 590 CCA by the way) has survived.

I know that a jump pack sealed FLA 17-18 amp hour Chinese unit may not last long yet all I can do is throw it on its pathetic ac wall charger and keep force feeding amperage on a regular basis. Like you said, scrounging parts from it may be a good thing to be able to do, and at least having 2 of them I should be able to keep the first one as the jump starter and use #2 as the phone and tablet recharger. At least that’s the cheapo plan.

[sternwake]

'Force feeding 'amperage requires voltages in the 14+ range though. Most every 3 stage charging source, regardless of brand or marketing mumbo jumbo, will never hold 14's for long enough to truly top charge a battery, and many of the jumper packs come with single voltage wall warts that will never get above 13.8v. I've had amperage taper to 0.00a measured by 3 different ammeters at 13.6v with this new healthy battery, yet when boosted upto 14.7v it was accepting 0.25+ amps for a period of time, indicating it was NOT fully charged.

Don't you have another plug in charging source? You can just hook the cables together and recharge it that way, you are not limited to the wall wart plug it came with. Just make sure whatever charging source you use is not going to take it above 15v for hours on end. If you do start cycing it deep and rely only on theprovided wall wart's limited maximum amperage the battery will not be happy with the low an slow 'gentle' type of recharge. AGMs can and do get tickled to death with too little charging currents when deeply discharged, and the common 'trickle charge it' mentality which is rife on the internet, should be buried, and smacked swiftly off the face of its next utterer.

Once I get around to testing it, i believe that this 18Ah battery, likely rated around 170CCA if it were to be rated, can start my v8 engine. Perhaps very easily do so.

So a 590 CCA battery will have to degrade quite significantly before it cannot do the relatively minor task of starting an engine, especially a fuel injected 4 cylinder in mild temperatures.

On automotive forums I get the impression that most drivers think a 600 CCA battery has 600 CCA till the day it quits. In reality most people and most mechanics have next to no idea of the actual remaining capacity of their battery and think the sticker on its side denotes its lifespan, rather than how it was treated by the vehicle nd owner and vehicle's charging system when it is driven. Modern vehicles need very little of the batteries available CCA/capacity/ performance toactually start the engine, especially on a daily driver.

The battery which noticeably is cranking the engine too slowly, well the neophyte 12v novice actually deep cycing the battery degraded to this same level in a Van would have known that the battery was toast as they would not be able to get through the late evening on its remaining capacity.

I once had a 7 year old everstart battery that could easily start my engine, but it could not recharge my flip phone and then still start the engine. Most people would call this battery 'just fine', as long as they never used it to charge the cell phone with engine off, and if it starts the engine, who's to argue? Well me, but what's the point.

I have no Intentions of Cycling this 18Ah MM battery regularly. i intend to keep it healthy with its maximum cranking amperage available for when I do need it, either to jump my Bigger AGM-27 battery when it inevitably fails or simpy gets drawn too low, or to jump someone else's vehicle. When it no longer has the performance to be able to jumpstart a vehicle, it is essentially worthless to me. Dead weight. even if it could still power my laptop for an hour, I would not be bothering to swap power cords to it individually.

Many times in the last few years I have been asked for a jump start, and I do not even have a battery under my hood to easily accommodate the person in need, and doing the nose to nose vehicle thing would mean i Might lose a prime oceanfront parking spot. No way would I trust someone else to actually hook the cables on thier end up correctly and not blow the donor vehicles engine computer, and I have seens sparks fly when those in need rubbed their 2 brains cells together and shorted the jumper cables and the donor vehicle stalled, later to be put on a flatbed.

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I did lightly cycle this battery again last night powering just a fan at slow speed for 5 or 6 hours, perhaps removing 0.5 amp hours from it, maximum. I let it have an hour of 14.7 earlier, but did not want to leave it unattended at this voltage while doing other things, so disconnected the charger. Right now amperage has tapered as low as I have seen it taper, 0.09amps at 14.5v.

I theorize with more ' break in' cycles, the amps it will accept will taper lower and lower at these voltages when fully charged.

But perhaps not.

[TWIH]

Agree that I have another way to try and top off the jump pack by using the ac powered 10/2 battery charger, hooked up to the jumper cables and turning the switch “on” so as to energize the cables. I could set that up and try it, I remember having done so a few months ago trying to determine the charge rate of the unit, which was something around 14.2 or 3 if I recall correctly.  

Exploring the capabilities of these jump starters is a good thing to do and learn about.

Appreciate your research and tests!

[sternwake]

I got a reply from mightmax battery and they said use the same specs as for the UB12180

http://files.upgi.com:8086/UPGFileServic...heet/D5745

5.4 amps or smaller charge current?!!!! Unlikely.

Turns out they sell 20th 20 and 22 AH batteries in this same exact size casing, but they do weigh more.

The UB12200 and the UB12220 for those wanting a bit more capacity in the same size package. One of Amazons search hits for the 2Ah version even says it is for a schumacher jumper pack.

I powered my laptop for an hour last night with it and then set the 40 amp meanwell loose on it at 14.9v.

Amps this time did taper to 0.09.

I tested my wattmeter's, and my Clampmeter's accuracy against a Extech multimeter. The Clampmeter is surprisingly accurate reading almost exactly in line with the extech rom 0.01 amps upto at least 6 amps.

The one portable wattmeters draw is measuring 0.02 amps, but on first powering up it will touch upon 0.03 a few times. So I suspect its parasitic draw is 0.0255 amps and gets rounded up on first power up when it draws a bit more to fire up the backlight.

The portable wattmeter seems to consistently read 0.1 amps low, at any amperage under 2 amps, but is dead nuts accurate with the other two ammeters above 2 amps.

I have been trying to figure out how I am going to wire this up to the automotive post clamps in my engine compartment AND be able to quickly remove it with minimal amount of fussing with tools and jumpstart someone else with some 8awg alligator clips with 45 amp Anderson powerpoles attached on one end.

I recall this youtube video where the guy tested the 45 amp andersons until failure with a 500 amp carbon pile tester, and they wound up passing over 340 amps for several seconds before the plastic housings and the 10 gauge wire insulation melted, the actual contacts inside appeared to remain intact and bonded.

This is far more than the 140 amps of the usual starter motor. My starter motor is actually rated at 1.4KW which at 12v is 116.7 amps and 140 amps at 10 volts.

So i think I am going to splice more 8awg into the existing 8AWG and use parallel 45 amp anderson powerpoles as each should be fine passing 70 amps for a few seconds if this battery alone by itself is to start my engine. Thw wattmeters being rated at 130 amps, surge, should also allow me to hook 2 inline and record the Max amps, minimum voltage, and Watt hours and amp hours. I pass 40 amps continuous through these wattmeters for 30 minutes so a few seconds of 70 to 80 amps should be well withint their mimits too.

Now to go check how many 45 amp andersons I have available.

[sternwake]

I have found various sites which say the UB12180 has 283CCA, and one which has said 243CCA.

I find this hard to believe.

This seems high to me seeing as how the Odyssey
Odyssey PC680 at 16Ah and 170CCA for 15.4lbs and 129$
Odyssey PC625 at 18AH and 220CCA for 13.2Lbs and 141$
Odyssey PC535 at 13AH and 200CCA for 13Lbs and 133$

http://www.odysseybattery.com/Specs/ExtremeSeries

Odyssey also lists battery resistance in the above link

basically the higher the resistance the lower the CCA

The UB12180 site linked in an above post says the Ub12180 has 18mOhm

Looking at the nearest resistance battery on the odyssey site,

the PC310 at 27.1 mOHM has 100CCA
the PC370 at 13.5 mOHM has 200CCA

So Since i trust Odysseys CCA figures way more than China's cheapest AGM, I will estimate that @ 18mOHM resistance, the UB12180 has about 170CCA.

Since it is highly unlikley I will be starting my engine at 0f anytime soon, which is the temperature in CCA, and I estimate my starter will draw 140 amps at 10v, I think this UB12180/Mightymax AGM battery's 170 CCA by itself will have no issues starting my engine at 60F.

Now is my Mightymax battery ANY different internally than the UB12180?
Are there more thinner plates? higher density electolyte? anything to promote higher CCA. Heck I would have to cut one open, to know. Or have a UB12180 to test and compare.

Since Mightymax basically said use the Ub12180 parameters, I am leaing way harder towards this MM Viper '600 watt" battery, marketed to the stereophile crowd, being exactly the same internally as the UB12180.

The 11.4 vs 11.9 weight on the spec sheets is the only thing favoring there being an internal difference, with the absence of other data to compare.

[sternwake]

Ok why not decide to measure the battery resistance?

Apparently One can measure the voltage of the battery before the load is app;lied, apply the load, see how far the voltage drops.

Voltage drop divided by load should give the resistance

So test number 4 I start with 13.07v and apply a 2.83 amp load (02mm computer fan) and voltage drops to 12.69v

13.07v - 12.69 = 0.38 voltage drop

0.38 divided by 2.83 amps = 0.134275 mΩ, well less than the claimed 18 mΩ resistance on the UB12180 data sheet

Now my particular fan takes a few seconds to ramp upto being a 2.83 amp load........... Room for error.

Must find other steady 2+ amp DC loads.........
2+ amps as my easy to use wattmeter is way more accurate reading above 2 amps.